Ep 112: Threesomes For All with Lola Jean

Art by @silverillustrations

Threesomes are a great way to explore sexuality and dip your toe into opening up your relationship. But how much of it do you plan and how much of it do you leave to chance? No one ever seems to talk about the uncomfortable parts of setting up a threesome, what makes a threesome good or bad, and what happens afterward? What should you discuss with your partner *before* you get in the sheets with another? More importantly, where is any of this information for that elusive third party?

In this episode, Effy and Jacqueline hang out with Lola Jean, an international sexuality educator, and talk through threesome strategies as well as bust some myths.

To learn more about Lola Jean, follow her on Instagram @lolajeandotcom, or via her website: lolajean.com.

To find more about Effy Blue and Jacqueline Misla, follow them at @wearecuriousfoxes, @coacheffyblue, and @jacquelinemisla on Instagram.

If you have a question that you would like to explore on the show, reach out to us and we may answer your question on one of our upcoming episodes. Leave us a voicemail at 646-450-9079 or email us at listening@wearecuriousfoxes.com

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TRANSCRIPT:

Lola Jean

Even things of like, how will I know when you're having a good time? What do you tend to look like? I like to tell people that a great question despite all of my efforts, when I'm achieving, like, my peak pleasure, I look like I am deep in thought and kind of angry. And sometimes that can be off putting like, oh my god, are you okay?

Effy

Welcome to the Curious Fox podcast, for those challenging the status quo and love, sex and relationships. My name is EffY Blue.

Jacqueline

And I'm Jacqueline Misla, and today we're talking about threesomes. What are the different configurations of a threesome? What should you consider discuss or plan before during and after a threesome? How can you bring up your desire to have threesomes or find person or people to have threesomes with lots of saying the word threesome?

Effy

Lots of threesome words. My first experience of a threesome? Actually, I should say my first experience of a threesome with a couple kind of scarred me for life. I have to Yeah, I mean, it just had so much potential. I had really high hopes I had so much potential. But really the way it turned out really put me off having sex with couples. In fact, to this day, I don't I would have to be really convinced like I would be I would have to be super convinced I'd have to know the people really well. Like they'd have to be my friends individually not as a couple like I wouldn't I want to like have separate long term established relationships with each of the couples so it's not necessarily a couple it still feels like three friends really? Even though there are a couple like that's when I would be convinced again to have sex with a couple they like ruined you.

Jacqueline

Yeah, they did.

Effy

They did they did was like right at the beginning of Lagos baby Polly roaming the six positive communities solo having a whale of a time. You know, I was like, right that and I was just so happy that I found this community. I was like, wow, it's exactly. It's exactly what I've been looking for all my life. I'm like, free, I'm free.

Jacqueline

As one does, of course.

Effy

That was really my mindset. And like a couple showed interest in me. And you know, I did a little bit of homework. They'd been around for a while. So people like knew them. So I knew that I wasn't gonna get kidnapped or murdered, which now I realized that low bar, you know, like at the time, not gonna get murdered, not gonna get kidnapped. Like, that's gonna come now I realize a very low bar. And that's not what the bar should be. But you know, here I was just learning all this stuff, their hearts, you know, and I was at a point in my life, like seeking experiences more than anything. So I was like, yeah, like, there's a great idea. We had none of the conversations that we talked about. In this episode, I foolishly assumed that they were on the same page, right? Because there were a couple established in the non sex positive community and non monogamous apparently and so I was like, okay, great, like there. They must know what they're doing among themselves. So I was like, great, like, I'm having I'm gonna do this. We've experienced couple, they're on board. I have, you know, my shit together. I'm not gonna get murdered. I'm not gonna kidnap. Great, I'm all in and they're pursuing me. By the way. I'd like to I'd like to really make that point. They were pursuing me. And I was like, great. Why not? So we got there. And you know, the lights were dim. And I've got to admit, it was a good transition. Like no one was messing around. There were some drinks, but like, we knew why were there for us. There wasn't like coyness. You know what I mean? Like there was sometimes there's coyness and threesomes, and people are just like pretending they just happen to be at the same place you know, with a bag of toys. I'm like, why are we being cool people? We arranged this like there has been conversations about this there's been email threads and lists about

Jacqueline

Trello with different steps Yeah.

Effy

So let's just get a more foot you know, so they were sort of have the same elk so great. I was like, great, you know, had a few drinks and the lights would dim and And we kind of smoothly moved into, you know, a sensual vibe. You know, there was like gentle touching, it was good. I was like, Okay, this is great, it's hot and the clothes started coming off, which is great. You know, I like a little bit. I don't like full nudity. I mean, when you're in it, you kind of want you to do obviously, otherwise things get in the way. But you know, but when you're like, touching and feeling I'm like a little bit of something. So I like different textures. Anyway, we're getting there was great. And as we getting, you know, hot and heavy, I noticed that he's more into me than she is, which is okay, you know, I'm okay about that. And at that point, I'm also super inexperienced with women anyway. So I'm like, fully interested. But I feel like a 12 year old boy, I'm just like, I don't know what I'm doing. So I'm like, I'll just take the lead from her. You know, so take your time, I'm not rushing to get it, you and so you take your time, and I'll take your lead. Like that's what I'm, that's what's happening in my head. No to self now, like, don't have that thought in your head. actually say it out loud. Right. So that's like, you know, difference between then and now. But that's in my head. And I'm like, Okay, I'll take your lead. And things are getting the kulturen heavier. That's way a lot of kissing is happening and hands are wandering a lot of skin skin. And, you know, I at this point, I have high hopes. I'm like, Yes, this is going so well. Who knew that these things would turn out so well at your first go. I'm like, you know, virtually patting myself on the back. And then, you know, I'm in it. I'm like, Whoa, look at me, this is great. Like, all this stuff people were talking about this stuff was so easy. And I realized I came to a realization that I lost track of her. Like, you have to realize at this point, and we're on the bed and like, you know, people are on top of people and it's often you can get you can lost track of somebody in a threesome. So I kind of lost track of her. Like, I couldn't feel her on me. I couldn't feel her hands on me. And then I kind of did this like, as I as I'm doing what I'm doing. I kind of like felt around the bed, like with my hands and obviously, while making it look really sexy. But what I'm really doing is like

you got like, She's nowhere near me. And then I maybe she's behind her husband. So I kind of like reach around him being all sensual and like still. Exactly. He's like, Oh, this is getting nice. This feels good. I'm like, okay, also, as you're doing like sexy stuff, especially group stuff. What happens is you kind of, you know, people don't want this energy. You know, I'm not a woowoo person. But there is like, when sexuality is heightened, like there is an energetic field, and you can feel you can feel the things that's happening within the energetic fields. Like that's the best way I can explain it sounds so weird. I hate myself for it. But that's just kind of how it feels. And I also kind of checked in, and I was like, I don't actually feel are in the bubble either. Like she's not in the fields, you know. So like, she's not only not within my reach, but she also doesn't feel in the field, like in the sexual energy field. So like, I'm, I'm there. At the same time. By the way, I'm multitasking. I'm so used to being in my own head. I'm also just like, getting on with the

Jacqueline

I'm having sex. Well, let's

Effy

sags well. So I'm there I'm like, Okay, I'm trying to figure it out in it. I'm like, Okay, well, she'll come back whenever she will. And I'm kind of that's where I am. And then suddenly, out of nowhere, with no actual preparation or warning, or nothing. The lights come on, and I mean, all of the lights, everything full whack, like going from like super dimly lit where you actually kind of just see the silhouettes of people. And you have to like feel around the bed to find someone like that's where we went from there to like reading lights. All the lights are on full blast fluorescent

Jacqueline

lighting, like you're in a doctor's office, like

Effy

that's exactly how I felt. I was like, Whoa, like, your eyes are like, like, are you going what's happening? And it's like, yeah, awkward, you know, you're naked and suddenly like, you know, you're naked obviously you're having sex but like suddenly you're very aware of your nakedness. Yeah, you know, initially I'm like shocked what's happening. Right? What's happening? Is this the end of the world like what? What could possibly be happening?

Jacqueline

In my first time I initiate the world possibly happening?

Effy

Is there a fire somewhere like what is happening? And then of course, my mind went Aha. Like, is she okay? Like, suddenly it might sound like are the ambulances coming like what's going on? So I'm like scanning around the room. I can like my eyes are like all over the place and like I can't, I'm like what's going on? And then and then my eye my eyes find her and she He's standing by the door with her hand on the light switches, one hand on the light switches and the other hand on her hip. And she's like, I'm not okay with this anymore. That's all she had to say. That was it. I am not okay with this anymore. And initially, I thought something terrible had happened, you know, like something something terrible, but the grandiosity of the reaction of the whacking on the lights in such an abrupt way that really like, killed it. I was like something terrible happened. And then it turns out, this is how they handle these situations, then they don't really talk about the things they kind of do to things. And when she feels uncomfortable, she slams on the brakes. And that is the end of it. And so he was fine.

Jacqueline

So it's lights go on, you're confused. He's like putting his pants on like, Well, that was fun. Yes.

Effy

Exactly. Exactly. He like he got off me. And he did that he didn't look shocked. I was further shocked by the fact that he just sing it. Yeah, well, that's

Jacqueline

why first of all, that's why he got to it so quick. You were like, you know, we got there. There was no compensate because he's like, there's a window time. I gotta make this happen as quickly as possible. But you know, I

Effy

had never thought of that. But now I get it. I'm just like, Oh, they're being cool. I'm like, no, he's like, I need to get this in. Gets boy gets shut down. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Not fun.

Jacqueline

But then was there a conversation with you or anything where they just like, let's get you a cab, like, what?

Effy

No, I was livid. I was so angry. No, they were they were actually kind of blase about that. Like, yeah, that's kind of how we do it. And you know, if the way it was explained to me is like, if one of us isn't happy, we stopped the situation. Right? Which, yeah, I get that. Right. I get that attitude. I get that. But how are you actually stopped? The thing is, is a thing. Like, you don't like tap me on the shoulder and say, hey, if the like, can we just pull it down a little bit? And not everyone's so comfortable? Maybe Can we have a conversation? Can we get your drink? Let's slow down. Like there are a million ways I can think of where you express you're not okay with something and you are 100% within your right not to be okay with what's going on? That's not that is not the questions, right? There's, there's no, that's not the question, how you do the thing. Kind of matters, right? Especially if you're experienced, right? Because, you know, by that point, you have tools available to you, you've done this a few times, like you have language behind, you're dealing with people who also know what they're doing. Like you can regulate yourself in a way that you can ease the whole thing down without necessarily like slamming on the brakes. You know what I mean? Yes,

Jacqueline

yeah. So now no to self get references. We gotta like Yelp it like we gotta go.

Effy

If I could leave a review so I would love it was satisfy some angry part of me.

I like half a straw. And that's where the good drinks and the good lighting

Jacqueline

Oh, wow. Yeah, that is some introduction.

Effy

Yeah, I was so mad. I got my I got so mad. I got myself a cab. Yeah, I just got dressed. I was like, not happy buddy. And then I kind of like, wow, ignored them for four years. Actually, I was I just, I barely spoke to him after and we kept running into each other in social circles and parties and things like that. And I was just like, I'm sorry, I can't I just haven't moved on. I really was a shitty experience. And I haven't moved on. I don't feel hurt by it. I think maybe now retrospectively, I don't know if I was traumatized at the time. I just remember being livid. Just super, super angry, and disappointed and disgusted by that kind of like bad manners. That was really more I just just like just terrible manners. I was

Jacqueline

like, Why are you so mad? You're like, because it was.

Effy

And then I found out like, that's what they do. Like, I told my story to people because I just like, I couldn't leave a review anywhere. So I just had to tell everyone. And people said, oh, yeah, they do that. Yeah. And they do that. So anyway, now. That's why the bar is not so low as I might not get it. Am I going to am I going to be kidnapped and murdered? Right the bar has moved up to Are you decent people? Are you decent people? You have manners. Do you have words that you can use rather than like whacking on some lights? Yes. Having said all of this, this is one experience of one woman and at one point in her life, not to be any kind of prophecy for anybody out there looking to have an experience with a couple, just make sure they're a decent, well mannered couple.

Jacqueline

So today we have the guide that now I wish you would have had, all of those years ago, we are having conversation with friend of the Fox, sex educator, mental health professional wrestler DOM and the world record holder of volume squirting solo, Lola gene. We love a similar gene. We spoke with her episode 94 on pegging and bought stuff. And our last in person workshop, before the world shutdown was Lola gene facilitating a workshop on threesomes,

Effy

which is kind of the information you want for the end of the world. I feel like if you haven't nailed that information that the world is ending, I feel like that information should be at the top of your list, like how to make a fire. How to grow your food, and how to have a successful fun three is exactly

Jacqueline

how you're gonna be quarantined with some folks. So how to get it on in a way that everyone is happy. Yeah, so she she did a fantastic job. And we have been meaning to have this conversation with her forever. And so finally, we were able to schedule it. And we now get to explore all of the things that people now we know what not to do. We know. Don't just have the bar and not being killed and kidnapped. Don't just flip on the lights when you get mad. And Lola Jean is going to share with us what we should do and do when we are venturing into a threesome. First, let me say loging This is not the first time we've had this conversation with you. We actually was this one of the last

Lola Jean

it was one of the last one the last

Jacqueline

it was the last workshop that we did when the pandemic that Trump sailed. While Yeah, we had you facilitate a conversation around this fantastic. And for now the three years since we've been saying we have you on the podcast to have this conversation. And so finally, we've all gotten our act together. And you are here and we appreciate it. We have you on to talk about all of the fun but play that we can do. And that was amazing. And I learned a lot and so I'm excited. I'm here with my pen and paper ready to take notes because threesomes while having been on my bucket list for a long time, it's not yet something that I have done.

Lola Jean

Ah, does that surprise a lot of people?

Jacqueline

I think so. I think so. I'm sure that people think that I've done I think people think that Fe and I've had sex and many times probably. That's right. Uh huh. I think that people think they don't know. Yeah, okay. It's

Effy

interesting, because I know he says that.

Jacqueline

He says all the times that she fucks her friends and she says how good friends we are. So I imagined that then we have the best effects that happen. Oh, yeah.

Effy

No, normally we tell people that though. I think we should let people like keep their friends. Or maybe we have

Lola Jean

when I host a podcast people just assumed me and my podcast hosts like, fucked or we're in a relationship or something. And it's also not the case.

Jacqueline

Yeah. Okay. But so I want to transition from here because speaking of our fantasies being grand thing, right? So threesome seem to be the gateway to non monogamy to kink, right? It's like the way we dip our toe into the water of these things. It's like first on

Lola Jean

the bucket list for so many.

Effy

In everyone's bucket list. This is exactly the conversation we were having setting up and coming up to this episode. We're like, why, why? And Jackie's like, I'm not interested in the why I'm interested in the house.

Jacqueline

Exactly. I'm like, why I want to do it. Because I do think that feels like control and being out of control together. Like it is a scenario that I'm controlling. But then it is an experience that feels like an adventure that I haven't experienced before. So it's like that nice combination of I hopefully know what I'm stepping into, but don't know what's gonna happen once there. That's what I think it's interesting to me.

Lola Jean

It's like, we know what two persons sex is like, mainly, basically. And then it's like, okay, it can't be that completely different, but I also haven't experienced it before. Yeah, it's playing with something familiar, which is always what I recommend to people, when they're stepping into kink is like, try something that's still familiar to you and then play around with it. So I guess I can see why. Like I'm saying that where it's just like for myself, that was like the first thing I wanted to try.

Effy

That seems to be the case. I also think that it's like if you're going to stray off the path. It's like the one that is the most socially accepted like the same this has the lesson like everyone's like, oh, a threesome, of course. Like of course you're gonna have a threesome, right? Whereas if you like I went to a BDSM party and I got whipped and was like, Oh, what are you doing? Yeah,

Lola Jean

It's so funny to me too, because like that is the assumption but then having been through it, and like, especially for the spice up your relationship talk. And even though like that was something that not I did to spice up, I wanted to spice up someone else's relationship, but it's like, it's not the safest way, you're probably gonna hurt someone in this scenario more than you would if you got spanked at a BDSM party. It's true.

Jacqueline

Yeah, I've mentioned that. Now, if you haven't been to sex parties that actually has felt like the way safer experience I felt more safe there than at a complaint club in New York City. Like I felt more like consent was was a practice I felt like more I could observe and just Boyer and that would comfortable. Like all of the things. So we have this fantasy in our mind about what threesomes are like, from your experience, what makes them great, and then also what makes them suck?

Lola Jean

Well, I think the first thing is like the elephant in the room, is that constantly what's in our mind when we talk about a threesome is we think a couple and a single person, because how else would three people get together? And I think an important thing is to get that out of our mind that that is the only way and in my vast experience where I was mostly the third, when it is three unrelated parties, so there is no couples dynamic. Those are some of the best ones. And I guess to Abby's point, when it's also friends or you know, someone yes, that can be really fun, it can be like sort of a bonding experience as well. But in my experience, why threesomes can be great is just exposure to more people and more people's bodies and how they experience pleasure. When I started having threesomes I had never been in a relationship either. So it was also my exposure to different relationships, different styles of relationships, ones that I admired, and ones that I thought were toxic. So like all across the board, and it really helped me with that exposure to more relationships, to figure out what I wanted what I was looking for. At the same time, too. It's also just it's novelty, it's a lot of stimuli. And having that many different models and configurations and bodies. Just that novelty on itself can be really, really fun. I know that usually when I'm like perusing porn, I want to group sex scenario, I want to see a lot of different people and a lot of bodies, that's what usually will get me excited. But reasons that they can suck is that you're dealing with so many people and so many dynamics. And especially if there is a couple dynamic, which is a power dynamic, you can feel like the odd duck out, you can get hurt, you can get ignored, you can get disrespected, you could at the same time feel a lot of pressure, there's I mean, when you add the more people you add the more different you know risks and dynamics that are at play, which is kind of again, going back to where having friends or even not if they're in like the threesome, or the group sex, but having friends outside of that, that you can talk to and that you can go to like, if you are a unicorn or a third have unicorn and third friends, it's kind of the same as like having kink friends, these are important to keep yourself safe. But I think it's important to know that like we have a fantasy of this going into it. And sometimes that can work to our disadvantage because we're trying to meet this expectation when there's also other people involved, who maybe don't have your same expectation.

Effy

Yes, absolutely. And I think when when you say threesome, or anybody's has a threesome, they, like we said there's a image that pops up in their head. And they mean that, right? They mean, one very specific thing, even though we're just saying threesome, and then if you sort of dig a little deeper, you realize, oh, no, what you imagine is very different from what I imagined. Right? So I'm curious to like, what are the different types or combinations of threesomes can we come up with

Lola Jean

so I mean, there's, there's so many types, because as with sex, kink, and all of it its imagination is the only bound. So you're going to come up with things that don't exist, because we're creative humans. And that's, that's the capabilities that sex can give us. So that's the platform it can give us what people I think commonly assumed, is going to be a couple plus one person. And then also by dynamic, where everyone it's mutual, everyone is attracted to everyone, everyone is sexually engaging with everyone in some way, shape, or form. And that's just really one type. So you can have a threesome where it's kind of like a two on one. So it's two people that are attracted to and pleasing that person, but they're not engaged or attracted sexually or whatever, to each other. It could be a couple and one person whether that's a throwable, or just a third, it could be three like unrelated parties, so no one is tethered to each other, but maybe they know each other. It could be a scenario where one person is kind of like the puppeteer and they're telling the other two people what to do either to each other or to them or just directing the whole thing. One person could be a voyeur there could be kind of like a, you know, two subs and a DOM scenario or vice versa. So really, it's just like, you know, the imagination is the only thing holding you back here. And I think the important thing for people to know is that you don't have to engage with everyone in the threesome. You don't have to be attracted to everyone in the threesome. Like you don't have to do anything you don't want to do in order to make everyone happy. And I find like one thing that I've gotten a lot from like, talking about threesomes and teaching this is specifically sis men will say, I'm not attracted to this person or I'm not into other sis men, why would I be okay with someone else being in the room. And that just kind of screams internalized homophobia to me or something where I call it like, dekha phobia of like, you can't have another penis in the room because some, I don't know, there's something about you that can't take that. But you don't. You don't have to engage with the other person, you don't have to touch them. I've had plenty of threesomes one way or the other where they've been fun for different reasons of engaging or not engaging. So that's that's an important thing to remember is like, the dynamic you're looking for is that you all can communicate and work together. And basically, you kind of find the dynamic of threesome that works for you based on everybody's wants and desires. Instead of being like, I need to have a threesome where everyone's males aren't everyone's genitals. And there's just simultaneous swapping. Like you can't force that onto someone that can be like your ideal. But ideally, it's everybody's wants, needs desires, dislikes that informs the type of threesome you're having?

Effy

It sounds like you want to be into the threesome, but not necessarily into everybody in the threesome.

Lola Jean

Yeah, yeah,

Effy

you don't you don't have to be

Lola Jean

and if that's a requirement for you, then dig deeper. I'm not understand why that is? Not necessarily because like, I have to be attracted to everyone, but understand if there are like threats or insecurities at play that are preventing you and therefore preventing the other people from experiencing something.

Jacqueline

Yeah, it reminds me what you said when we were talking about but play and you were talking about not just to think about the actual experience, but think about what you want to feel in that experience. Because what you want to feel will drive what you want to do. And so it sounds like instead of just picturing three bodies together, do I want to feel dominated? Do I want to feel in control? Do I want to feel like I'm a part of something? Do I just want to what like that then will drive potentially what the experience could look like? That makes sense?

Lola Jean

Absolutely. Because like, right now, like I'm saying three, seven, everyone's gonna have something different in their mind of what that looks like for them. So we can think about how we want to feel, yeah, that can influence the experience. And whenever I say this, like I feel like it always goes like I want to feel aroused. I want to feel hot and horny. It's like great, awesome, probably. But we need more descriptive words than that. So like, do you want to feel overwhelmed? Do you want to feel like less responsibility? Do you want to feel voyeuristic, like all of these different things can help us then lead to situations or even then of like, maybe some of our worries. So I always express to couples that like, I am just instinctively going to worry so much about them and their experience. And that kind of stresses me out. And it makes me focus less on my own experience. So I like talk to them about that upfront to see if they're going to be on the same page as me, instead of just assuming that like, I'm more concerned with them than me, I want someone to be invested as well. And that's just from my past experience. So I like I talked to him about that upfront. And I one time I had a couple that was just like, Okay, great. And let's just focus on you for like the first 10 minutes. And then we'll just ease into whatever and I was like, Oh, that thank you.

Effy

That question is always at the key questions like how do you want to feel, which I think is just such a great way to start exploring how you want to have a threesome, I'm curious to what other things that people should first I feel like do a self inquiry right ask themselves like, what are the things they should consider for themselves? And what are the what are the things they should be discussing with the others? Be it your partner, if that's the case, be with the people, the individuals? If that's the case, like what are the things that that we should consider?

Lola Jean

I think especially when there is like a partnership at play, but of course it's applicable to everyone is asking yourself when you have like boundaries or rules where that's coming from or why that's occurring. Recently, I've been hearing the difference between boundaries and rules described as that boundaries come from a place of love and rules come from a place of fear. So if understanding if you have certain rules within your partner, so I've like engaged in a lot of threesomes or encountered a lot of couples that would be like, Okay, our rule is that this person is not allowed to have sex with you, but I am and you know, is that coming from a place of like, we're trying to conceive a baby and that would be weird if that happened because of this dynamic that's going on, or is it like I'm gonna get really jealous. And that's why it can't happen. Because if that's the case, when it comes to like jealousy, that's a symptom of something else, whether it's an unmet need or an insecurity. And by pushing that off, like you're pushing off the inevitable it's you need to address that it's gonna come up. So you're just trying to prevent yourself from feeling a feeling. Jealousy isn't a feeling we should be preventing ourselves from feeling we should address why that's occurring, and then like, try to neutralize it. So I think one of the one of the biggest things is just like, I think in threesomes, because of like the controlling aspect, you were talking about Jaco and like, a lot of people try to control too much. And that can sometimes prevent people from experiencing or prevent their own desires. And it's not to say that, like, have no boundaries, but like, our boundaries should also have a rhyme and reason. And our boundaries should still consider other people. And when we're potentially limiting them.

Jacqueline

Yeah, and I think particularly in the scenario that you just described, where it's to a couple and a third person. And again, to your point, there's this idea of a unicorn, this floating person who not only just exists to but really wants to engage in a couple who wants to engage with both of those folks in whatever those terms are, and then afterwards is happy just only being available for those experiences, right doesn't want anything more, it sounds like it in those cases, it feels like that person is a character in your performance, that they are someone who you are enlisting to be a part of your fantasy and not an actual person with their own fantasies and needs and wants. And so even coming approaching it from that perspective feels like a shift.

Lola Jean

Yeah, and even like just saying it like that, it kind of, it's like if someone identifies as a third or a unicorn, it's like, you're assuming they're a monolith. And like, maybe that is the case, maybe they just want to kind of pop in pop out, they'll take care of themselves. But for a lot of people, maybe that's what they think is the case. But they also don't know like, I went into it being like, I want to be a unicorn and a third, I'll be an accessory, I'll pop in pop out and none of the drama. And then I learned that, oh, I actually require a lot more than that.

Jacqueline

So based on what you just shared, you went into it thinking I can do this, this will be great. And then as you start to experience, you're like, actually, I feel like I need something more. Looking back, what are some of the things the lessons learned in that experience? Or what are some things that you would have asked yourself, or that you ask yourself now, before you enter into an experience,

Effy

I think that's like, it's

Lola Jean

a great opportunity also to address that, you know, the three of us talked about these things a lot, sex, love relationships, and all that. And it can sometimes be easy for us to say, figure out what you like and what you want, and how you want to feel and all these things. But that can actually be really difficult. And sometimes we have this pressure to like, know how you want to feel and know what you want and know your boundaries. And it's totally fine not to know that or to say I think I want to feel this way. But I'm not 100% Sure, until I'm in it or I thought I wanted to feel that way. But it turns out that wasn't the case, or whatever that may be. So being being gentle with yourself. And also not feeling that pressure to know how you want to feel. Sometimes it's even more helpful to say, I know, I don't want to feel this way, it's a lot easier to commit to things we don't like, than to things we like because we don't feel as tied to it in that case. And I think some of the things that I realized was and like, these are things like I'm still realizing so I'm in I'm in my first relationship, which is also my first non monogamous relationship as well. And even going into that I thought that, oh, if I have relationships outside of this, I won't require as much because I'm getting all of that from my main partner. But then I learned that like, oh, everything that I require in my primary relationship, I actually also require in any other serious relationship outside of that as well. And it was something similar with casual sex, I thought because it was casual, or because it was a threesome, I don't necessarily require the things I would in like, you know, committed partner sex or my one on one casual sex. But like, it turns out, I do, it turns out that I want to have a friendship and communication, it turns out that ghosting also sucks with a couple as much as it does with a single person. And that was something that I started to prioritize. If if I were to look for a threesome with a couple, I would prioritize it to be somebody that I would hang out with if we weren't going to have sex. So like I want to continue a relationship with them. Maybe we have sex, maybe we don't. But I think they're super cool. And those were the ones that turned out the best otherwise, like I would honestly, unless it was that case, I wouldn't really want to have sex with couples. Unless I was in a sex club scenario. I found that that to be a very good one for group sex because I would have friends there. So no matter what happened with the group sex, I would go hang out with my friends I get after care for my friends. I could like cuddle and chat to them and have fun. I'm very much for quality time. Love Language person. So I love talking. So that could be a way that I could unwind if a scenario wasn't the best or I wasn't getting what I needed from it afterwards. But otherwise, like I just I have so many Bad and like toxic experiences with couples that I would take a lot more time and getting to know them if they're dynamic and who they are. And honestly would probably avoid it a lot of the time,

Effy

I hear you, I think that's what I'm actually in terms of like, who I would want to have threesome with, I find couples to be too complicated. They also find there's an imbalance of, I'm going to say this, and I'm going to reflect on it in dance of curiosity, I feel like the couples sort of know each other in such a way that it kind of like, sucks out some of the curiosity, then it's like, me being curious about them. And they may be curious about me, but they're kind of like, they have their own scripts in between them. And that I'm just like, ah, that's not interesting to me. Like, for some reason, like, that's just not interesting to me. So I struggle with the couple threesome as well. And I do think that the baseline of friendship, yeah, like, you gotta fuck your friends.

Lola Jean

Like, okay, so actually, here's a, here's a great scenario, I am going to a wedding in a couple of weeks, I have a couple that I met on field. And they were that was another scenario, I like the best ones, I still have relationships with them. Where I think after we like went on a date, I remember saying to them, like, you guys are super cool. And I really enjoy hanging out with you, like, would love to have sex with you. But if we don't like I would just like to continue getting to know you. And like, we ended up having sex. And it's like, I mean, they live in London. So it's kind of on again, off again, sort of thing, but we keep in touch a lot, because I think they're really cool. But I'm going to their wedding. And I'm bringing my partner over there. He's actually already met them before when they were in the US. But like, I continue relationships with whether it's like one person or both people in the couple, but those are those are the best ones for me.

Effy

Nice. Yeah. Nice. Yeah, I get that, I get that. Okay. So regardless of your, you're a couples person, a solo person, strangers, friends, whatever your congregation are, what in terms of the planning of this thing, right? Give us an idea of what are best practices for before, during and after. So,

Lola Jean

I mean, I guess it would kind of depend on your configuration, because you there, let's see if a threesome there's three people. But then if there's a couple, they both have their individual needs, and boundaries and desires and all that, but also their couple unit ones as well. So it's not just three individuals that have to communicate, it's also the couple and the the single person as well. But I would think it's really helpful to plan out maybe different positions that everybody thinks is hot or enjoyable, and like maybe doesn't feel left out on. So maybe one person really loves watching. It's like, great, we can do one where you're in this position where you're able to watch us or you're positioned underneath of us or whatnot. I know that like I don't like feeling left out, and I get nothing from watching at all. So even if I'm not involved, I'm like, can I be underneath you, and then I can just kind of like feel the situation going on. So that's pretty fun for me. So it's thinking about those ahead of time, so that way, maybe you don't get down to all the different positionings that you all had planned for. But it's kind of like planning a scene in BDSM, where it's like, I don't know the exact script of how this is going to go. But I know a couple places, we've all agreed on that we can go so if there's kind of like, you know, a lapse or you know, a moment where we're not sure what to do. We're like, Oh, what about that thing we talked about? as well. And that I find that that really helps to guide the threesome. So especially if you are a control freak, or a type A personality that can be helpful to kind of have have an idea and also to gauge everyone's interest in it. So that way you don't kind of spring on a configuration that one person is really not cool

Jacqueline

with what I heard so far than in the pre planning is, first check in with yourself, how do I want to feel in this experience? Then communicate with those involved? How do you all want to feel and experience within that conversation, look for red flags. So if you are saying if you're saying as much this is what I want to avoid, as this is what I want to create, Get back, get it back into the intentions of why you're trying to avoid the thing. And then if it feels like everyone is on the same page, then create some ideas or some guides or some configurations that can help begin to lead the way until things start to kind of organically flow on their own.

Lola Jean

Yeah, and I find it often helps when one person is kind of more of a director. And that doesn't mean they're telling people what to do but they are just like leading and presenting the scenario. So maybe this is someone who's more comfortable with the conversation or who knows more about what they how they want to feel or those kinds of things because it is very difficult. And that person can lead with giving options as opposed to fill in the blank. So hey, here's a scenario that I like I like this positioning and configuration because it gives me XYZ, here's one that I would rather not do because of XYZ and that can kind of give people something to kind of guide them like oh, okay, I see what we're doing here. Someone also already volunteered something they liked and didn't like so now I don't feel that I'm going to be the odd duck out or Sighs by saying what I like or what I don't like, we're all in like a sharing capacity here. And then at the same time, too, it's, you know, it's kind of like workshopping these things together. I love a good group chat beforehand. That's also a good time to figure out like, are we bringing any toys? What's going to happen when we need a break? What about afterwards? What do you like to do or beforehand, I'm really big on just like planning and after activity, so it doesn't just kind of like, end and be done, whether that's, you know, dancing, or like having a drink or going to the park or whatever it is. So that way, you can kind of have like, a nicer transition instead of like, let's get you a cab home. Sometimes that can feel really abrupt, and that can kind of take away from your experience. So these are all good times to plan for that to talk about barrier methods to talk about, you know, goes and no goes. So I always tell people beforehand, like, do not put your hands on the back of my head. If you do, I will take them off. Just don't don't do that. It freaks me out. So these would be things to tell people of like, even different triggers of things that might happen that they should avoid. It's not when people ask for boundaries and triggers. It's not an opportunity to be like, cool, no scat play no blood. It's like, okay, yeah, were those are not things that are going to come up with that it was a lot of negotiation. So let's talk about things that are more specific to avoid even things of like, how will I know when you're having a good time? What do you tend to look like? I like to tell people that great question. Despite all of my efforts, when I'm achieving, like, my peak pleasure, I look like I am deep in thought and kind of angry. And sometimes that can be off putting, like, oh my god, are you okay? So I have to like, explain that or maybe explain what your tells are? Or like, if I'm kind of despondent and quiet and off to the side, like maybe check in with me, that's probably not a good sign.

Effy

Yeah, I think those are so important, such good questions. Similarly, like, I am a talker, like you are and like, Jacqueline is very spiritual, because during sex, especially if I'm having good sex, nonverbal, hmm, not interested in talking, no words, nothing which throws people you know, so if you're if you have that kind of a, you know, idiosyncrasy, definitely mention it, for sure. And I love also like you're saying, I'm, you know, what, what would I look like? What would it feel like if I'm triggered or activated or not having a good time? I think I think that if people know what that looks like, is also so important. So I love that

Jacqueline

even as an opportunity then to think about that for yourself. I don't know, if I've sat back and thought about what does it look like when I am disengaged? What does it look like when I am experiencing deep pleasure? And whether or not we talked like talking during sex, it does sound like talking before is important. And I think there's a myth that if we talk too much about it, it takes away from it. Like we can't like it just has to happen. We can't We can't go through all the details of the thing. And I think there's a way in which you're describing it when it actually creates anticipation. It likes makes it harder when you're like, What do you want to do? And what toys should we use, like the way in which you can talk about it doesn't have to be like sitting down, we've flipped your paper, unless you're me, and then we're probably going to sit down with Luke, that's probably

Effy

gonna happen. I do love the group chat idea though. Some of these things are just like easier and in writing. And you also it's also good for clarity. Like there's no misunderstandings like you miss miss hearing something. It's all that and you can like do everything on a group chat. And then when the day arrives, when the day comes, you can arrive at your threesome with like, all the everything handled. So you don't have to have these conversations like on the day, if it's available to you. If you're having an impromptu threesome, good on you pause, have a conversation and then get into it. Yeah, I'm

Lola Jean

just thinking about that. Like all these things are for like, you know, planned and orchestrated ones. But what about the impromptu ones as well like, where you don't have the group chat, where maybe it's someone you already know, maybe it's someone you haven't met before. And like, you know, if you're going to do anything impromptu, you have to get really comfortable with improvisation. And with knowing a lot of things that you you don't know, and not assuming. And that's also where it's kind of like, if you ever had like the sex, that's also kind of a getting to know you, it's a very quick way to get to know someone if you're going to like, do it correctly, and be very curious about them and be okay with like, lots of pauses, and chatting, and like, really just learning as you're going.

Jacqueline

Yeah, because it feels like then in either case, whether it's brand new, you're planning in advance, being present and curious is really, like, well, the conversation is gonna get get us into the room and hopefully make us on the same page. But then unless it's part of what you described it, there's not a script, right? Unless it's designed to be a script, there isn't a script and being fully present is actually the most important that Yeah,

Lola Jean

and when you have all these goals in this pressure of like, this is what the threesome has to look like. And this is what my fantasy is. That's going to prevent you from being present and it and it's going to put a lot of pressure on other people too. Because one of the beauties of group sex is because there's also more people it's tends to be a lot longer just a lot longer than a regular two person deal. And, like, I mean, the best ones I've had, there's a lot of breaks, there's just a lot of hanging out naked, and things like that. And just with the last threesome that I had, I remember there was one person who was like, I think I'm tapped out. And that was just like, your mind is your body like exhausted, they're like body mind, soul, I'm just tapped out. I'm just gonna hang over here. And like, sometimes that's how you'll know when it's ended, as well, too. But I think kind of getting away from this, like, really linear path, which is what group sex like enables us to do is like, it's gonna be a lot longer, and there's gonna be a lot of breaks, and it's not going to feel like a movie. Like you were there for the commercial breaks.

Effy

Yeah, I love that. I love that for sure. Okay, I'm curious. So we in our heads, you know, imagine all the different ways we've done our planning, we've got not gotten to know ourselves, we've got our boundaries, we've got our how we want to feel we have our language, we're open minded, yet kind of informed and curious. In our heads, we're ready for a threesome? And what if we are a part of a couple, and we need to enroll our partner into this adventure that is taking shape? In our minds? How do we approach a partner about threesomes?

Lola Jean

So first, acknowledge that if you're approaching your partner about this, that probably means you've had a lot of time to think about this, to talk to yourself about it to fantasize, that's great. They also probably need that time. So anything that you bring to a partner, no matter how long you've been with them? Don't approach it as like, check yes or no? Will you do this with me? Yes or no? You have to answer right now, what do you think? Are you going to do it, you need to let them formulate their own opinion. And maybe, you know, it'll take longer or shorter, maybe it's something they've already thought about or not, but you need to give them that time. So expressing that they don't need to say yes or no, it's just something that you've been thinking about here are the reasons why you're excited about it. And like sharing those, whatever it is that you've learned, and allow them that space to fantasize about it, sexualize it or or come up with different, like even worries that they may have that you're able to address. And I think this is one of the important things when I talk about people bounding up to, you know, prevent them from feeling certain emotions. If you're approaching your person, and they're talking about their different worries about it, don't just like set things up. So they don't feel their worries, like you need to work through whatever those may be. And maybe those are things that then turn into boundaries, or maybe those are things that you're able to work through together. And like ultimately, when it comes to pushing outside of like our heteronormative view of sex, when we add kink, when we add group sex, or any of those things, it's kind of like a fun little exposure therapy, of a lot of these things that maybe that you were really scared of that were really intimidating, you're able to do them and be like, Oh, I did that I survived, or I learned something from it, or it made me stronger, or this thing I was so scared about isn't actually that scary. I thought seeing my partner with another person would just like, bring out the devil horns and me. But instead, I'm just like, really appreciative of them. And I like seeing them happy or like, I like cheering them on when they go down on someone or something like that. So you don't know what you don't know. Firstly, so kind of giving both of yourself that grace, just approaching it from a lens of like, this is a thing that I'm into, they are under no obligation to meet that need for you. Just because you want to do something does not mean another person has to do that. Or, you know, you have to decide if this is something that's integral to your relationship, you know, so maybe maybe it is something that like this has to exist, and then maybe that person won't be the fit for you. But most likely, this probably isn't something that has to exist in all of your relationships. So really not approaching it as an ultimatum. And then just, you know, getting getting curious together, thinking about low bar ways to start to explore this that aren't necessarily jumping into a threesome, or adding a third party that might potentially get hurt from your, you know, being in equipped as a couple doing this.

Jacqueline

Yeah. So that makes a lot of sense and questions, so many more questions around what that looks like, before we even go into what those conversations could bring up. What is in those conversations look like with someone who is not in a couple. So either a third, or stranger or friend that you're approaching about this adventure?

Lola Jean

So I think one conversation that I'm assuming couples have beforehand and that it doesn't just happen this way is like who is interfacing? Is it one person is it both of us. And that's actually really, really important. And I judge people a lot based on what that is or why that is maybe it's like, this person is so busy and they hate meeting new people, but they want to do this and like that makes a little bit more sense than like, this person is the gatekeeper. And they're responsible for both parties, because you don't have to get to know both of us. Just one of us. Again, I'm a talker. I like quality time. So I'm like I'm not just gonna go based off of a picture as well. So I think that that's something that is important. I'm like kind of veering off though this was like of the third person right of approaching that third person.

Jacqueline

Exactly a third person or or group of friends. Maybe they maybe as you start to talk about it, yeah.

Effy

Yeah. Like your non partner, you're like the other people that you would have actually that aren't necessarily a partner that you might have a certain dynamic in place. But what about if you're trying to enroll? recruit others that aren't you're pulling into your games, fun and games?

Lola Jean

I guess it also depends on like the context of that, is this a scenario where this person has already expressed interest in not necessarily having a threesome or group sex with you? But is this something that they do in general? Or are you in an area where like, if it's a sex party, or it's a non monogamous dating app, or something like that, like, is there something that already gives the inclination that like, they might be interested in this, or are you kind of cold approaching a random stranger that you think would be a good candidate or who you're attracted to, or you have a good relationship with, if it's someone that you already know, just like considering that like, bringing this up might change the dynamic or context depending on that person, and, you know, their openness or ability to like, talk about things and understand I think, if you already know them, really starting with the conversations, like I don't want this to change our relationship, and I don't want you to feel that, like, you have to do this or you're obligated or any of those things. Because if this is a relationship you care about, and you want to continue, you should be able to foster this, whether whether this threesome is going to happen or not. But I will just express to them that this is something it's a desire that you and your person have, maybe describing why that is or what you're looking for. And then inquiring if this is a thing that they're ever interested in, or what they're interested in about it, try not to make it solely about you and your person, if you're trying to attract a third person, it's still dating at the end of the day, you know, you are maybe you are a couple and you're trying to attract a third person, but like you're still dating them. So it's gonna be very similar to when you were dating your person, you're still going to have to get to know each other, and court them engage with they're interested in instead of being like, here's what we come with. Do you want to join yes or no?

Jacqueline

Yeah, you know, as you're talking about it, and thinking, so there are multiple scenarios you described, right? We can go to different apps, we can go to different parties, we can talk to our friends and folks in our community. And we can reach out to and engage a sex worker, if there are conversations where we want to say this is actually what we're looking for, is it something that you are comfortable with willing to do excited and have expertise in, if there doesn't want to be that kind of dating element, there is another option.

Lola Jean

And like, if you want something that is cut and dry, and you don't want to have as many variables to deal with, going to find a sex worker is a great option, because they're very equipped with being with having the checklist. And maybe they've even done this before. And they can suggest things. But if you want something cut and dry, where you don't need to worry as much about the third person because a sex worker, one, they can worry about themselves, they can also advocate for themselves. And they probably do that regularly. So they're more experienced than that. But it can feel at least in the front, a little bit more like a business transaction, which can be comforting, especially if you want someone to kind of hold your hand through it.

Jacqueline

Yeah, it's so I wanted to circle back to the conversations that we're having, either with our partners or with other folks, are there anything apart from jealousy that may stand out as a red flag? Like, if we are so excited about the thing? How do we know that we are actually not trying to pressure someone into it or convince them like what should we either be hearing and what they're saying, or if we're the person hearing it, what kind of red flags if someone is really like trying to convince you of something that you're not really into yet,

Lola Jean

I guess this kind of depends more of like, the dynamic and makeup of the person. Because sometimes people can be really into this as well. But like if your person is only doing it, to satisfy your needs, and so that you can feel happy, like, for me, I don't like that as much, you're just kind of like putting up with it. So that that can make me happy. Like, I want people to be actively enjoying some part of it, whether it's like engaging with me, or seeing me happy with someone else. But if you feel like that person is just acquiescing. And again, this kind of depends on the person, because for some people like who are super service oriented, and they just want to please you and make you happy, and that's a part of your dynamic, then that could be great. But I always see it as a red flag if people are just doing things to appease us, and they are not deriving like any kind of satisfaction or enjoyment from it.

Effy

So I have a practical question that I want to sort of interject in there. I know that severs six protocols are different for different people, because everybody has a different risk tolerance and whatever you're willing to tolerate, and the risk of really reflects on what you need to feel safe when you're having sex. So I know that it's an individual preference and ideally, you are playing with people who share the same risk tolerance as you or at least tolerate your level and you decide what that looks like. I am curious to see if there are some best practices when you have multiple people playing like are there some best practices for threesomes in terms of If sexual health,

Lola Jean

if you are using toys, put barriers on those toys, that is a very easy way to spread, germs spread STIs and it's something that we don't think of, because a lot of times when we're using sex toys, it's with ourselves or with a single partner. But that's, it's a great way honestly to just for for cleanliness sake, but like you can put a condom on a hatachi, you can put saran wrap around a bunch of things as well, too. So that's something that's often overlooked. Definitely having like a taller area where you can easily dispose of anything that needs to be disposed of. So you're not constantly like running to the bin or something like that. And then also just being conscious of like, when there is any switching between people like assessing people's comfortability with that and having to like, wash off or use a barrier, because sometimes we just I think we just think like condoms or bus. So it's like, as long as we're using a condom before we penetrate someone, and everything's fine. But there's, I mean, there's a lot of skin to skin, mouth to mouth and things beyond that, too. So unless it's just like pregnancy, that's the only thing that you're trying to avoid, or, or to mitigate that risk or, and it's honestly just about everyone's risk tolerance and risk profile, and not assuming that of people too. So whether that is, you know, making everyone aware of like, hey, here is my latest, like, STI check here are things that I am positive for, and here is how I mitigate risk with that. And here's the things that I'm negative for or like, I get BV a lot. So I would really appreciate it if we cleaned things before anything went in or around my vagina, that would be great for me. And I think beyond that, it's just like understanding with like, all types of fluid play, whether that is spit, whether that is sexual fluid, whether that is a jacket or anything like that all of these things come with risks. And sex in general comes with risk, and we assume risk all of the time. So it's just assessing what that level is. And especially now with COVID. Like, that is spread easily via spit. So like you got to be very conscious of that as well.

Effy

For sure. Absolutely. One of the protests I was given when I was getting old nerdy about this is that, actually for threesomes internal condoms are better than external condoms. Because internal condoms, you can switch between people and the condom stays with the vulva owner versus an external condom, where you have to constantly switch condoms. And if you forget, or if you're in the moment, you are having to stop, change a condom, and then go again. And actually internal condoms kind of make that transition smoother. I was wondering like the pro tip that I was given,

Lola Jean

which I that's a good idea. I don't have as much experience with internal condoms, but it was, I used to have a problem where condoms would just tear all of the time with me. So I was going to make that swap. But then I guess it never, never happened. That was also recommended for that reasoning. The other thing I was thinking of too, is just like, have a strap on and donate on hand. I don't care if there are people with penises are not in your configuration. It is a good idea.

Effy

I concur.

Jacqueline

Feels like a life tip.

Effy

Don't rely on a penis and get hard for your pleasure just like having

Jacqueline

fun handy that just feels like practice.

Lola Jean

Maybe penetrative sex isn't a part of anybody's menu at all anyway, and that's totally fine. But if it is have it on hand.

Effy

Yeah, totes, what a great what a great note to end

Jacqueline

I know. Exactly. And on that note, before we let you go if you are good with it, we have four quick questions to ask you to get to know you a little bit more. The first of which is what is one piece of advice that you would give to your younger self about love sex relationships,

Lola Jean

I think about this so often, definitely, is to understand the difference between desirability and pleasure. So desirability is focusing on like, what other people find attractive and then embodying that versus pleasure is, what do I enjoy? And those are two different things that I got confused and I just focused on the desirability

Effy

and the advice for anyone at any age at any time. advice. Good advice. Okay, what is one romantic or sexual adventure on your bucket list?

Lola Jean

This one actually just came up recently. I'm a little bit baby brand, probably because I'm like a new Auntie to two babies as well. But I would love to be in a threesome with a couple that's conceiving or trying to conceive or group sex scenario that just it feels like something really cool to be around. Oh, yeah. And I'd love to like assist in that I'd be like a big cheerleader.

Effy

I actually know a baby that was conceived. I

Jacqueline

know that baby too. That's where I got the idea. I was like, Oh my God, that's that's the beautiful thing. This baby grows up. People are gonna be like, I know where you came. Again, as every time we ask this question, it becomes more and more self evident. But Lola Jean, how do you challenge the status quo.

Lola Jean

I am a brat, which means I like to challenge everything. It is in my DNA. And I think one of like, the biggest ways is just really binaries. Anytime anyone says, There is one way to do anything, I am like, liar. But I'll just challenge it and like figure things out that way. Because there's, there's always things that are going to deviate. And it's, it's still a cop out to being like, most of the time, it's this. And if it's not for you, that's okay. Like, give examples of the way that it's not like that, if it's if it is not one way. And it could be 99% of the time. But I think that's where a lot of these questions we all probably get. Is this normal, but I do this and it's different. Like, we can start talking about, you know, destroying binaries everywhere, then everyone can find their place.

Effy

I love that. Yay. Absolutely. Okay, last but definitely not the least, what are you curious about lately,

Lola Jean

I so I am a co headmistress of the seven days of domination, which is a marathon kink education series, that specifically providing low cost education to sex workers. And recently, it's just taken this really fun dive into history and learning of not just like the history of kings in general, but like the history of how this like showed up in society. Why was there a moral panic around this specific activity? And it's been really fascinating, like, in kink in general, I love learning about like, why is someone into this thing? What's the psychology behind it? I mean, I'm also a little bit of a history nerd. So then when you get into the history of things like it can get really, really interesting.

Effy

You have to come back and tell us all about it. Because right now I'm like, Tell me more. I want to hear it at all. I am doing a deeper dive into history of orgies and group sex, actually. So maybe we can exchange notes because really, the private sector has only been in the last few 100 years. Like we don't have privacy period. And if you look at sort of like ancient civilizations is like orgies on a Tuesday night, you know? So like, the idea of the sex that we have now, just like private coupled sex is actually fairly new. And I'm kind of interested in like, the history of group sex and like, what was it like before and how did we of course, church got involved and here we are having the sex that we're having, but like, I'm kind of like, this is where I'm at so we're gonna do an episode on this. So maybe we can do like history of orgies history of kink in one episode. Love it.

Lola Jean

Yeah, it's, I mean, this week is fluids week for seven days of domination. So it's all that themed, but like when you were saying that's like, we didn't even go to the bathroom privately. That was all. It was. Exactly.

Effy

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So love it. Thank you so much, Lola Jean.

Jacqueline

Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for having me again. Oh, so much fun to talk to you. One more of Lulu Jean. First, check out our interview with her in Episode 94 where we talked about pegging and bought stuff. Then visit her Instagram, Lola Jean sex ed and on her website, Lulu jean.com, where you can sign up for an online workshop including seven days of domination, which brings you some of the world's top pro Dom's as a shed light and knowledge on a number of topics and skills within BDSM. If you have any threesome tips, or interested in exploring a threesome, let us know. Head to our Facebook group and discuss the episode with other listeners and curious foxes. And keep up to date on upcoming episodes and other fun foxy Ventures by coming onto our Instagram and following us and make sure that you are clicking like or follow on whatever podcast device that you're listening to, so that we can come to your phone every single week for more curiosity and fun. And of course, join us on Patreon where you can not only get the podcast in advance of the general public, you also get many episodes behind the scenes and access to all of the workshops that we did pre pandemic including the threesome workshop by Lola gene, and all of the Zoom post pandemic workshops that we did for folks. You have access to it all. Have a question come in and want to share a story reach out to us at listening at we're curious foxes.com or call us at 201-870-0063

Effy

This episode is produced and edited by Nina Pollack who is an important player in our podcast trio. Our intro music is composed by dev Sahar. We are so grateful for that work and we're grateful to you for listening. As always, stay curious friends. I am forever impressed how much you can how you can pull that off and then like screw up my three lines for need for Nina has like I did her little parts. Okay, do you have Oh Oh,

Jacqueline

okay, no, I'll do it again Sex Ed, thank you. I was like six at the gala dinner

Effy

recording in progress, Curious Fox podcast is not and will never be the final word on any topic was solely aimed to encourage curiosity and provide a space for exploration through connection and story. We encourage you to listen with an open and curious mind and we'll look forward to your feedback. Stay curious friends. Stay curious, curious, curious and curious. Stay curious.

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