Ep 108: Modern Monogamy, Fidelity, and Relationship Satisfaction
Art by @morelaaand
How do you define modern monogamy? What does fidelity mean in the context of monogamy? How do you design a monogamous relationship so that both parties can thrive?
In this episode, Effy and Jacqueline are challenging the idea that monogamous relationships have to be one-size-fits-all. They celebrate those who are choosing to nurture one romantic relationship, take a meaningful look at our understanding of fidelity, and discuss how to identify what values lead to longer-term monogamous relationships satisfaction.
To find more about Effy Blue and Jacqueline Misla, follow them at @wearecuriousfoxes, @coacheffyblue, and @jacquelinemisla on Instagram.
If you have a question that you would like to explore on the show, reach out to us and we may answer your question on one of our upcoming episodes. Leave us a voicemail at 201-870-0063 or email us at listening@wearecuriousfoxes.com
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TRANSCRIPT:
Effy
Welcome to the Curious Fox podcast for those challenging the status quo in love, sex, and relationships. My name is Effy Blue.
Jacqueline
And I'm Jacqueline Misla and today we're talking about how to have a thriving monogamous relationship. I know that many of our episodes talk about or share the perspective of people in non monogamous relationships and it is absolutely our intention to challenge the standard perceptions of partnership. And we have a lot of love for monogamy. We think that monogamy is fantastic for those who thrive in that structure.
Effy
Yay, monogamy. I actually do have a yay monogamy dance, which you can't see right now. I should just like make a real or a tick tock of it. But I do have one. I am so pro-monogamy.
Jacqueline
I would watch that. I would like to see that. And then we have to talk about what inspired the dance. Yeah, no. I mean, I was in monogamous relationships for most of my adult life. And my current construct actually has monogamous aspects to it. I am poly Fidelis, in my particular construct, that means that I am in two parallel relationships. So I switch back and forth between two homes and two partners. And each partnership looks pretty monogamous, except that there's two of them. Apart from that, like if you're looking at it, they're monogamous relationship. It's just I have two monogamous relationships. So I know I mean, I know the feeling of wanting to feel safe and in a closed relationship. I know the feeling of beings feeling stuck and bored. I know what it feels like to want structure and freedom like I I've been in the monogamy space. I see the value of it. I've been in the stuckness of it.
Effy
Yeah, yeah, I think same, spent many, many, many, many years doing a horrible job of being in monogamous relationships. But you know, being there done it. Honestly, I think whether you're monogamous or non monogamous relationships can get hard. And I don't think that it is necessarily about the relationship structure, but how it's working for you. So I think, yeah, monogamy is great. As long as it's working for you know, monogamy is great. As long as it's working for you. It's really kind of that simple.
Jacqueline
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. That's why I think that the conversation that we're gonna have today is important, because we're going to be leveraging your concept of relationship by design, and that is for every type of relationship, but we will put the monogamous spin on it for all of our monogamous folks.
Effy
For sure, yeah. So if you're in a monogamous relationship, or want to be good for you, if you're in an open relationship and have a co-partnership, or monogamous characteristics to your relationship, like Jacqueline's, or if you know, monogamous folks, even though it's not for you, but you want to be the supportive friend, the supportive people in their lives, so they can have thriving relationships, then stay tuned, we're going to dig right into that after this break.
Jacqueline
So recently, you and I have been sharing some wild stories on Patreon
Effy
We have absolutely, I think it's like those days when we used to have actual events. And there were like the main piece of the event, the workshop or the moderated panels, and then, you know, we'd get to the social side, and we started having like one on one conversations. I feel like the smaller audience of Patreon reminds me of those conversations that they were like, more intimate, more insightful, more personal, funnier, things that we just like, wouldn't share on stage, for some reason felt good sharing in like smaller groups around after the events like after-hours conversations.
Jacqueline
Yeah, no, it's true. I mean, I recently told the story on Patreon about how I used to wash rinse and repeat techniques on more than just my head.
Effy
And it's such a great story and if you want a clip of it, just just a tiny clip just to get a glimpse of it. Jump on our Instagram and you'll See, we just like put a put a tiny little glimpse on that. And it's absolutely hilarious. And I can tell you, it's not even the most hilarious part of that story. Just letting you know.
Jacqueline
That's true. I mean, I want to say shiny and bouncy and danger free. No, that's exactly your point. If you've missed that story, and you did not hear it, then first, you're not following us on Instagram. We dropped the sample a teaser, if you will, in one of our recent posts. And so head over to we are curious foxes on Instagram, click the Follow button and never with one of my embarrassing stories ever again. And if you want to hear the whole story, along with a lot of other things that I probably should not be revealing about myself, then go onto patreon.com and search. We are curious foxes. Patreon is what makes this podcast possible. Were able to have these conversations because of your encouragement and financial support. So number one, don't use your conditioner on anyway. Number two, we need to be Instagram friends so that we can stay connected and you can get sneak peeks of upcoming episodes and hear fun teasers from Effie and I and our after hours. And then number three, support us on Patreon where you not only get these amazing stories, you get episodes before the general public, you had access to a million workshops and trainings that we've filmed over the years and then this year, you're gonna get some fun little gifts sent to your door.
Effy
Can I say how exciting so find us online and dulls your curiosity? Okay, so let's talk about monogamy.
Jacqueline
I am ready. Okay.
Effy
So let's talk about modern monogamy, which is kind of what we set out to do here. And the reason why we going down this modern monogamy path is because monogamy used to mean one person for life these days, we mean one person at a time, which is but important take on an old concept like monogamy. And I think when we say that when we say okay, we are saying one person at a time, I think it is worth asking one person for what exactly?
Jacqueline
Yeah, yeah, I agree.
Effy
Right? Because the lines seem to be what do you think about monogamy a non-monogamy you can mull it over. And I think have all the conversations I think it really ultimately gets reduced down to kind of two main axes, I the lines that delineate monogamy seem to be sex and intimacy. So it's one person at a time to have sex with and to be intimate with? Yes. So we kind of have to think about that. Right? If that is the case, if we're really saying what defines a monogamous relationship with sex and intimacy, we kind of have to have a good understanding of what we mean by sex. We're gonna dive into that, and what we mean by intimacy, what we mean by that, right, because intimacy is, even more, mushier than sex. So because we have close relationships with friends intimate relationships with maybe coaches, and inseparable siblings, intimacy is already in our lives. Yeah. But there seems to be a line where it becomes pertinent to a core relationship. So like, where's that line
Jacqueline
yet? And that do to your point, that line is much more blurry, right? Like if we're talking about traditional sex, and if one is thinking about intercourse, in this moment as sex, I know, the actual moment. Like there's an actual like, something isn't. Oh, okay. So now, right. But when it's emotional, and it's just flirting, and then it starts to be feelings and insert, like, Oh, that's so much harder.
Effy
Yes, yes. Yes. Yes, absolutely. So let's start with the seemingly easier one, right, the seemingly easier let's start with sex. Right. So we're not giving no monogamy the main difference is who you're fucking right if it just gets reduced down to that, right. So let's talk about fidelity. Fidelity seems to be the cornerstone of monogamy. Right? And it's an interesting idea because fidelity is always spoken when we talk about monogamy. Fidelity actually means faithfulness to a person cause or a belief demonstrated by continuing loyalty and support. Isn't that beautiful?
Jacqueline
It is beautiful. And you actually I'm gonna pause you you said we talked about fidelity in monogamy. I don't think we do. I think we talk about infidelity. Yeah, I actually don't think that we ever talk about what it means to have fidelity in a really.
Effy
Yes, I completely agree with you. What does faithfulness to a person cause or belief demonstrated by continuing loyalty and support mean to do you?
Jacqueline
Yeah, I love the demonstrated part.
Effy
Exactly. What does faithfulness mean? What does loyalty and support mean? What does that look like in behavior? Right? Not just in thought, but in behavior? You're absolutely right. We don't have conversations about fidelity, when we do is merely reduced down to sexual fidelity. Yes, right. Are you having sex with one person or more than one person? In fact, that is, even though I think fidelity definition of fidelity is so, so beautiful and so so right for relationship or relationships, actually, because you can have faithfulness to more than one person, but I don't use it. In my practice. I don't use that language. In my practice, I use integrity instead. Because it often in the context of relationships, especially monogamy, it gets reduced down to sexual fidelity and loses its beautiful, nuanced effect.
Jacqueline
Yeah, yeah, I think that's all true.
Effy
So when you are thinking about monogamy, you do have to take a moment, ideally, more than a moment, but at least a moment, to be true to yourself and ideally, communicate to your partner. How important is sex and sexual fidelity to you? Right. And in order to do that, you have to start with defining what sex actually is, right? The societal description, the easy answer is, as I love to talk about it is hard penis and a wet vagina, is what we mostly mean when we say sex often, right? But that is, but is that right?
Jacqueline
Right. Right? Or to what vaginas?
Effy
What about Yeah, what about crossing a boundary or two penises considered crossing a boundary? Or three or four legs? What is exactly its penetration? Where you close? Okay, is sexting with no intention of meeting them ever? is cheating? Is that is that fallen? Is that sex? What about the cam? Girling? Right? What about? What about being on the other side of a laptop and working with a professional? Is that sex? Is that? Is that kind of sex? Okay. All right, what are the boundaries around what you think sex is? And is there anything that falls outside of those boundaries? That is sex, but actually okay, in a monogamous relationship? For you?
Jacqueline
Yes. Yes. So in this moment, close your eyes. And imagine the scenarios and see what is coming up for you? Is your partner flirting with someone cheating? Is that crossing the line? Is it kissing? Is it fantasizing about someone else? Is it touching them? Is it is? What is the thing where you were like, Alright, now we've gone too far. Now I'm gonna get mad. You know, we throw cheating around loosely. And it's only after we think that someone has crossed the line. That then we named that that line was was there. Right? Right. And so yeah, so step one to modern monogamy, is figure out what cheating is, what fidelity means? What integrity means to you? And then find out if you and your partner are defining it the same way?
Effy
Yeah, it's so so important. And also, since you're doing some imagining, and your eyes are freshly closed, and you're putting yourself in those situations, would those boundaries change if your partner was including you in those things? Right. So is it okay, if your partner is is cam Girling on their own? And then now you can go live with them? To suddenly there's the boundaries change?
Jacqueline
Right? Yeah, yeah. If you're both at an event or party, and the decision is that you're both going to flirt with other folks. And then get that stirred up energy and bring that home like, right, what is the thing? What is Yeah, and I would even add, does it change? If you imagine yourself doing it versus your partner? Yeah. Because it does for me, the idea of me kissing other people, that sounds great. Do my partner doing that? Not so much. And I think what makes it even more challenging is we're talking about crossing the line and knowing where the line is, in defining the line is, what if you do all of that, and you have the conversation with your partner, and you realize that there is a gap between the kind of sexual intimacy or sensuality or kink that you want? And then what is available in your relationship? Are you clear? Is there a conversation about how you can meet your needs, while still being integrity based on the boundaries that you and your partner have defined?
Effy
Exactly. It's nuanced, and it's ever changing. And we're going to talk about that in a minute. Yes. And it's absolutely pertinent to get that stuff, right, because that's exactly where relationships start to struggle from and it's in these misalignments, or the The ignored conversations or the assumptions right? There are so many assumptions that are made when you enter into a monogamous relationship because monogamy is heavily prescribed by our society, we see it from our off most most of us it from our families, TV, to our feed to Disney to Hollywood, like the idea of monogamy is everywhere. And most of us hold an ideal of monogamy, and make a bunch of assumptions as we go into a monogamous relationship that most people enter monogamy.
Jacqueline
But even in the examples that you've shared, we see what monogamy looks like from the outside, right. So like the end of the movie, they get together and yay, and like happily ever after. Right how they are doing the monogamy. So we know monogamy exists, we know that that is, you know, for society, the preferred way of being. But what does that right, then it doesn't show after they go home, how they have the conversation about, well, actually, I want to be flogged and you don't. So how are we going to meet that need for me like that conversation? We don't see. Yes, a movie, for sure. And so I think that it's about defining, but then also realizing that you may define something and your knees will go past that. And what is appropriate to do with that, besides ignoring your needs.
Effy
Right, right. Exactly. And I think I mean, six pieces is definitely one that is important, because it's kind of tender spot, but at the same time, like you can be monogamous and sleep in different bedrooms, right. Like there's so much that is assumed about monogamy that you are monogamous, you are married and you have to be under the same roof. Do you? Right, is that do you? Is that? Is that? Is it a mosque is that the only way you define my vision
Jacqueline
is to have two different houses with like a bridge that joins I believe this I'm gonna manifest it that. Yeah, I don't want my room. I want my whole whole as house and a bridge goes to. Yeah,
Effy
I agree. I agree like finances another area. Like there's so many areas of our lives, when we apply it to monogamy. We just make so much assumptions and make those leaps without really having those conversations. Right. Yes. And then another. Another big area. And that's up there with sex is this idea of intimacy, right. So much talk about intimacy, one romantic partner at a time. Right? What does that mean to you? What does romance mean to you? What does intimacy mean to you? Like, right, Missy into me? You see, right? What does it look like? Maybe in friendships? Right? So like, I would say, you and I have a very intimate relationship. Right? At one point, this intimate relationship has an impact on your other core relationships, that it needs to be a conversation. Right? So let's say you will now Gomes and at what point do you need your partner to be like, Hey, there's this person that you really need to know about? Or like, what is that conversation like, right, and people have intimate relationships with friends and mentors, and coaches and siblings and, you know, people that you would pick up that phone at 3am in the morning and go and help them out, or the first person that you call when you hear something that's, you know, exciting, or, you know, like, when my dog died, I called you you stayed up on the phone with me until I fell asleep. Like it doesn't really get more intimate than that. Right. So when does that have an impact on your monogamous relationship?
Jacqueline
Yes. Yeah, emotional intimacy, I think is really hard. When famously now, there was infidelity in my relationship, which sparked actually me joining. And my TED talk at some point is going to be like, Why? Why infidelity? It was great. But in that case, it wasn't it wasn't a physical breach. It was an emotional breach, right? My partner fell in love with somebody else and did not tell me about it until after it happened. And that that felt like a lie. We also did not talk about that. We weren't like, Hey, don't fall in love with somebody else and not telling me that okay, but there's so many moments that lead up to that moment. There's to your point, there's something exciting I got a call this person, they said something that's so funny. I want to hang out with them, or I'm starting to flirt with them. Oh, no, I'm starting to think about, all of those moments. And one can't be in integrity, and either talk about it or shift and do something differently. Unless there is a conversation around. What is the distinction between appropriate I'm using air quotes and be intimate, emotional relationships based on the definitions that you have in your partnership. And then what crosses the line? Yeah,
Effy
exactly. Exactly. And I think how you want to feel in your relationship is a really important conversation to have. Right? Yeah. Do you want to feel safe, secure and grounded and predictable? And all that, you know, you know, this is the spectrum, right? Or do you want to feel it's a space for adventure and exploration and experimentation. And, you know, risk, you know, is that the space that you want is a space where you, you feel like you're going to learn and grow and do like, personal work. And that's going to be the main focus, like you do need to also decide how you want to feel in that relationship? And how are we going to maintain that feeling? You know, how are you going? How are you going to? What are the things that you're going to do together to maintain that feeling for those in it? Yeah, you know, right.
Jacqueline
And, and as that evolves, as you raise evolve as your desires and wants evolve, so all of this can, and we're going to keep sharing more, but continues to be under the bucket of what is it that you need and want like doing that self assessment, and then seeing a if you're getting that in your relationship and be if you're even defining it the same way, or if they want the same thing out of the relationship, because even if you're in a monogamous relationship, you are not going to get all of your needs and desires met in that partnership. Like let's just name that not every single emotional need and friendship need and intellectual, it can't, it just can't, there's too much pressure for one person. So you're gonna get that from friends and co workers and family. And so then how do you know when, when an emotional line is crossed?
Effy
Exactly. I think the important thing is, what are the values are important to you, that needs to exist in a core monogamous relationship so that you can feel satisfied with that relationship? Right? Like, what are the core values that you can't abandon to be in a relationship with somebody, because over time that abandon that value is going to feel like abandoning yourself. So you need to be super clear, super honest, both with yourself and your partner, like, these are the values that are absolutely essential to me. This is what it looks like for me, in order for me to have these values fulfilled values to stay in integrity with this is what it looks like. Right? And then you need to co create that environment, you co create that relationship and work at it and to keep going back, keep checking in saying, are we in line with the values that we agreed? Am I still do I feel satisfied? What does satisfaction look like in a relationship? Right? And that's not about your partner? That's about the values again,
Jacqueline
Yeah, that I think was the hard part for me. So step number two, to monitor monogamy is to define intimacy, where I hear you saying determine what makes your monogamous relationship unique, figure out what you're creating together. And then how do that as it evolves. And that's the piece that that has been hard for me over time, because people change and needs change, and desires change. And all of that change feel scary. And particularly if you feel like you and your partner are not changing together. And this is not a monogamous problem or a non monogamous problem. This is just people being in connection with people problem. But I think back to my monogamous marriage, and all of the small moments when I felt a shift in me, and I didn't know how to talk about that feeling, without shaking what we created. And then of course, I suppressed it and suppressed it until it erupted like a volcano. And then frankly, that's behavior that I brought into my monogamous relationships. And so in the past, I would hold on to stuff longer than I should because I was afraid of the conversation. I was afraid of the consequences. And so it was not something that I wanted to bring up. It was something that I was avoiding.
Effy
Mm-hmm. Again, it just shows though, right, that you are in a monogamous relationship, and then it's you in a non-monogamous relationship. And in both cases, you're still struggling with the same thing. And you're not alone. Like I'm not picking on you, I am the same. The things that I struggled with in my marriage are the things that I struggled in my consequent monogamous relationships, and then initially my non-monogamous relationships, because it's not really about the relationship structure. It's really about me, and me not knowing what my values are, what my priorities are, and what I need in relationships and how to ask for that and how to creatively figure out how I'm gonna get those needs met, and then honor the same process for my partner or partners. Right and that is the piece that needs to change for, I think, for all of us to have satisfying relationships regardless of their structure. And that is why we need to have regular check-ins with ourselves. First and foremost, we need to keep that inner connection going and that feedback loop my satisfied What am I needs? What are some other ways that can meet those needs? What if I don't meet those needs? Are they just going to pass? Or are they just going to become more and more cutting and claw at me? And you know, is it going to disrupt these gonna become disruptive? Right?
Jacqueline
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes. I appreciate you saying that. Because I think that if there had been at the time, structured moments, where we were did check ins, right, so if we knew if I knew, every quarter, every month that Rihanna vert, whatever it was, like, we're gonna have this conversation, then there would have been a space to share Yes. That should be assumed, there would be a space for me to have that conversation without me having to bring it up and say we have I have something we need to talk about. It's that moment that feels hard. It's the approaching and being like, Oh, we got to talk about this. Versus if there is built in to our construct moments and points where we know we're both going to sit down and talk about the evolution of what we need and how our relationship needs to evolve.
Effy
I think you're spot on that I think two things. One is, it works on both sides, it's for people who feel like they are not going to have things addressed, right. And they're in a conscious state of anxiety because they feel they're not going to be heard. And they battle with this idea of like, you know, I want to talk about things all the time because I just don't think this is going to be my only time and there's anxiety around am I going to be heard am I going to be seen? And then that sometimes develops into? Why are we constantly talking about our relationships, I definitely hear that especially people who are transitioning into non-monogamy. But I think in monogamous relationships, people just get stuck around a certain topic. And that's all they talk about for a while. And that becomes close to phobic and annoying for people. Right? So having set regular check-ins, just alleviate issues across the board, for people who struggle to have conversations and bring things up and sort of assume the worst and really struggle with the idea of conflict, all the way to people who feel they're not going to be heard. So they want to just make sure they say all the things all the time until you know someone's fed up of hearing it right, having regular chickens, monogamous, non-monogamous with yourself first and foremost, and with your partner or partners. Just important, you know?
Jacqueline
Yeah, yeah. And I like that, because I think it gives us permission, then the intention that we know we're going to evolve and just asking the simple questions, right. So step number three to modern monogamy check in regularly. You know, I now I know I asked the question. How are you feeling about our relationship pretty regularly now in you know, certainly, anniversaries and New Years. But just in a regular moment of connection, I can ask, you know, are you still happy? Is there some part of you that doesn't feel seen or realized within this relationship? Is there anything that you need that you're not getting? Are there changes that you would like us to consider there? There are some questions now that I've learned over time, are important to ask, or to have structured, like, you're gonna go through these bullets when we do these check ins, because it gives both of us an invitation and permission to be able to share things even if they're scary.
Effy
Absolutely. And I think even like broader questions that are self reflective, like, what does happiness look like for you these days? Right? Are you still happy?
Jacqueline
Oh, that's wonderful.
Effy
What does happiness look like for you these days? Like, what are the things that are gonna get you that and keep you there? Nurture that feeling of joy? Yes. It's just space for the person to self-reflect and share. And then see, okay, this is what happens looks like for you. This is what happened. It looks like for me, like, Well, how do those two ideas, sit together, play together, right beside each other and nurture each other, you know,
Jacqueline
completely that actually really resonates with me, because my wife and I had a similar conversation recently because we have very different ways of unwinding. At the end of the day, she, you know, we both work really hard, long hours, both on Zoom conversations all the time, and she unplugged by watching the news and catching up for the day, which is the actual opposite. I read, I read a few New York Times headlines and articles in the morning just to like, make sure I know what is going on in the world. And then I avoid everything else. Yeah, and I either do something creative or I do something mindless I'll be on TikTok, or I'll be painting or something that is way away from the news. So what ends up happening is we're in two different rooms. So we're in two different rooms all day during the day, and then we're in two different rooms in the evening. Because we probably we do things differently. And so we've had to have that conversation and say, Okay, how do we interrupt how do we give space for that? And when and how do we interrupt that? So that we just don't ever see each
Effy
Right. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I think those are so, so important. And I think, again, the reason why people don't have this conversation is a couple of things. One, again, the full settings, right, monogamy has the full settings. They are very, very clearly put out there in all these all the different channels, but they are just default settings, right? You still get to fiddle around with them to make them fit you. Yeah. So one is like you assume that's just what monogamy looks like. Right? And our invitation is, does it right?
Jacqueline
Or even that even when you're saying? That's what it looks like? What is that? Yeah, what is cheating? Yeah, what is falling in love with someone else? Like, what? What is that? Yeah. Do you know what that is for you? Do they know what that is? For them? Do you know what it means for each other? And what is it that we're saying? monogamy is
Effy
exactly I think it's just it's important that there is nothing as absolute now that you know, I can't say this enough. I am a big big advocate of monogamy. Monogamy is right for you. Go forth and be monogamous. and have these conversations, define monogamy for yourself, be super clear, be on the same page with your partner, and make sure you're thriving and continue to tell each other what thriving looks like for you. And to see how all of this stuff Alliance.
Jacqueline
Yeah, yeah, I agree.
Effy
So before we wrap up, I do want to address a one thing that does come up. And it is this idea of monogamy being natural or not race, there's like so much rhetoric out there. People are saying monogamy is not is not natural. And some people like it's very, very nationalist. Evolutionarily, we're programmed to be monogamous. And there's other people saying absolutely, there's no way monogamy is natural, I just want to address that, because it really doesn't matter if monogamy is natural or not. Right? Someone with a perfectly healthy libido can choose to be a nun or a monk and feel entirely satisfied. So it really doesn't matter whether monogamy is in your DNA, or if it's a choice, the important thing is you just don't have to settle for the default, right, you get to choose how you want to be in a relationship. And as long as it satisfies you, as long as you feel like it is calling you is where you're meant to be. That's all that matters, the conversation around monogamy non monogamy being natural is really, really irrelevant. Because we're, as humans have transgressed natural states many, many years ago. So just something for you to consider out them. The definition of and the implementation of monogamy has evolved over centuries, and even during our little lifetimes. So you do not need to be held to the changing whims of society, you can choose to design a relationship where you and your partner can have your needs met, desires met, where you can evolve and where you can thrive.
Jacqueline
Yeah, absolutely. Because if you don't define it, it will be defined for you. Or, you know, if you if your vision is want to be in a monogamous partnership, and maybe be a parent and be a homeowner, you know, all the things are even I mean, nowadays, I don't know who can own a home. But if you want an apartment whatever the vision is, just having that name of a partner or parent is not enough description of what that means. And if you don't define it, Instagram is going to define it for you. Yeah, right. Your friends representation of who they are, as a partner or parent is going to define it for you. Because then you're going to think, oh, that's the standard. That's the thing I'm supposed to be that's the thing we're supposed to be. So screw all that. Change the noise, right? tuned down all of the things and then get quiet with yourself. How do you define it? How did the two of you define it? How are you going to create together? I love that you said that earlier? What are you in partnership going to create together? Yes.
Effy
Really think about that relationship as a third entity that you're both co creating together. It is not your partner it is not you it is the thing that you're working together to build a container that is going to hopefully with the standard humanity of those in it is going to be flexible and squishy and ever expanding. So you can change and you can grow or you can shrink for a little bit and go into a cocoon and do what you need to and that the relationship itself is that in service of you, so that you can thrive based on whatever you need.
Jacqueline
Yes, in service to you. That is not I don't think it's a way that I have thought about relationships before. That it number one, I mean, I certainly thought about it, that it is something outside of me. But I don't think I thought about it as something that is in service of me that they use, and in service of my partner or partners, that it exists to support us to in whatever way we need to be supported at the time. Yeah. So that I think creates a shift in the way we're all of us should be thinking about how we're defining things, how are our definitions of what we want in relationship built to serve us and our partners? Exactly. Yeah. So in summary, monogamy is fantastic. If that is what you want to do, and that structure enables you to feel safe and seen and thrive, then go forth and be monogamous, your kink is not my kink, but your kink is okay.
Effy
Not yet. People, monogamy is great.
Jacqueline
We mean, this is great. That's great. And second, be sure that you and your partner are defining monogamy in the same way. Right? You can you take some time to define what fidelity is what cheating what integrity means to you, and then find out if you to have shared definitions. So, for example, how much physical or emotional intimacy do you need at the moment? And if that evolves, then what is available to you and your relationship? And what is not? And how do you get those needs met? Just have the conversations, write those things down and make sure that you're spending time thinking about how to intentionally design. And then number three is you can actually forget about whether you're monogamous or not because designing a relationship is the same no matter what the construct, so get clear together beyond just love. I know you say this all the time, when people are like, you're like, why are you together? And they like it because we love each other?
Effy
Wow, it was the wrong answer. It's not the wrong answer. It's just not enough of an answer. But yes, I do like to keep a buzzer around and just I don't really say that like that. But I but sometimes,
Jacqueline
right, but certainly loving each other is important in the relationship. But that's not enough, right? It's not enough. What do you want to create together? What do you want? You know, what is it that you want to build together? And to do that, then we have to have regular check ins with yourself with your partner, because people change circumstances change the relationship needs to grow and shift as well in service to your point in service of us in those changes. And then if you know, if you can't meet some of those needs in your relationship, but where do you go? Can you do it on your own, with friends, with family, with strangers, whatever, whatever the thing is, that allows you to be aligned in Integrity with your agreements, then do those things right? So define communicate, meet your needs, evolve? Repeat. Go through the cycle again.
Effy
Yes, yes, I think I don't want to end in a sad note. However, I think it's also worth adding right to the end, that you might not be getting your needs met. And that happens. And it might even be with the person that you love dearly. And non-monogamy can be an answer. Or it might just be that a monogamous relationship is not the answer. So I think you do need to think about those things. And sometimes the people that we love, are the people that are the more most compatible with and that is a sad truth.
Jacqueline
But it is the truth. Yeah, I agree. And I'm going to add to that, I think that I have tried to continue to introduce myself to my partners over the years because the person who they first got into partnership with is not the same person that I am now. So that person that you're with, and that relationship with that you had may not be the right one. It doesn't mean though, that you can't have a better relationship with that person in your state. Because honestly, if you're feeling you're not getting needs it, I'm sure that they're feeling the same way. Yes. And that you all just haven't talked about it. And maybe there is alignment around the things that need to shift but both of you have been too scared to say it because you didn't want to rock the boat and shake the things and upset the kids and yeah, yeah, so agreed with you, this may not be the thing that works for you, but it may not be the structure. So non monogamy is not the answer to an unhappy relationship. Right? We know that in this particular relationship by mine might not be right for you, but maybe it is and maybe it's just about getting clear and discussion and evolution through that. So if you want to share your thoughts about money hug me or talk about the concepts that you heard today, then Head to facebook and join our Facebook group. That is where we go to have the conversation. And if you want to keep up on upcoming episodes and share your curiosities about the topics first follow and like this podcast so that we can continue to arrive on your phone each week. And then follow us on Instagram where you get sneak peeks of the upcoming episodes. And then of course, very special place in our hearts for Patreon members, deep appreciation for your support. And it is because of you that we can do all of the things that we do so go into Patreon support but then get behind the scenes footage and mini episodes and millions of instant millions. It's like 50, but a lot of education led workshops. So go to Patreon and we are curious foxes and then let us know that you're listening by reaching out to us directly. You can send us an email or a voice memo at listening. We are curious foxnews.com Or you can record a question for the show by calling us at 201-870-0063
Effy
This episode is produced and edited by Nina Pollack, who we are quite faithful to our intro music is composed by dev Saha. We are so grateful for that work, and we're grateful to you for listening as always, stay curious friends. Then stunned she says Oh then Stan be absolutely what are you doing with your life?
Jacqueline
Commercial over commercial over.
Effy
Curious Fox podcast is not and will never be the final word on any topic was solely aimed to encourage curiosity and provide a space for exploration through connection and story. We encourage you to listen with an open and curious mind and we'll look forward to your feedback. Stay curious friends. Stay curious, curious, curious and curious. Stay curious.
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